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BBC Radio 4

Lucy Worsley investigates the crimes of Victorian women from a contemporary, feminist perspective.

Lady Killers with Lucy Worsley

In the final episode of season two of Lady Swindlers, Lucy Worsley and her partner in crime, Professor Rosalind Crone, are joined by novelist and game designer Naomi Alderman, author of the award-winning book, The Power. 

Together they explore one curious question - did our Lady Swindlers have superpowers?

From the strength and agility of Minnie Pheby, the Lady Burglar, to the psychic abilities of the Fox Sisters, these women used their talents to surprise, deceive and outwit the men around them. Whether they were slipping through windows, conducting séances, spiking drinks, or stealing museum masterpieces, each Lady Swindler flipped expectations on their head.

Lucy, Rosalind, and Naomi also take on big questions about women and power. Is crime a form of resistance? Do we romanticise female criminals? And what would a truly equal society actually look like?

Diving into the themes of The Power, they explore how stories and swindles expose the deeper gender dynamics of then and now. Featuring a lady burglar, spirit mediums, a hocusser, a drink-spiker, and a French art thief on the run, this finale asks what these women’s crimes reveal about the nature of power and women's lives.

Producer: Riham Moussa
Readers: Clare Corbett, Lauren Leko, Jonathan Keeble, and Alex Phelps
Historical Consultant: Rosalind Crone
Executive Producer: Kirsty Hunter

 A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4

50. Swindling Superpowers

Lucy Worsley is back with another episode of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to revisit the audacious and surprising crimes of swindlers, hustlers and women on the make. Women trying to make it in a world made for men. 

In this episode, Lucy is delving into the life of Elizabeth Manning, a daring Lady Swindler known as a hocusser, who spikes men’s drinks and empties their pockets in Victorian London. Most men she hocusses are too embarrassed to report the crime - but when will Elizabeth’s luck run out?

With Lucy to explore Elizabeth Manning’s story is the barrister Nneka Akudolu KC who shares her experience of prosecuting spiking cases today.

Lucy is also joined by historian Rosalind Crone, Professor of History at the Open University. Lucy and Ros visit the site of the lodgings where Elizabeth hocussed at least one of her victims, and Brixton Prison, the destination of many women who were trying and failing to make a living in Victorian London. 

Lucy wants to know how Elizabeth Manning went about hocussing her victims. How common was this crime in Victorian England? And what can Elizabeth’s story tell us about spiking today?

Producer: Jane Greenwood
Readers: Clare Corbett, Jonathan Keeble and Alex Phelps
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

49. Elizabeth Manning - Hocusser

Lucy Worsley is back with another episode of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to revisit the audacious and surprising crimes of swindlers, hustlers and women on the make. Women trying to make it in a world made for men. 

In this episode, Lucy is exploring the lodging houses and pawnbrokers of Victorian London on the trail of French art thief Amelie Decuzpere. She and her husband Paul make a habit of moving into new lodgings and swiftly disappearing, taking with them everything that isn’t nailed down. But, as Lucy discovers, they also have an eye for a valuable old master painting. 

With Lucy to explore Amelie Decuzpere’s story is the illustrator and graphic artist Malika Favre, who shares Amelie’s experience of living in London as a young French woman. 

Lucy is also joined by historian Rosalind Crone, Professor of History at the Open University. Lucy and Ros visit the Bow Street Museum of Crime and Justice to find out how the police went about tracking down Amelie, and the site of a London pawnbroker’s shop where Amelie was a frequent visitor.

Lucy wants to know how different women’s lives were in England and France in the mid-19th Century. And how does a foreign Lady Swindler navigate the English justice system?

Producer: Jane Greenwood
Readers: Jonathan Keeble and Alex Phelps
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

48. Amelie Decuzpere - International Art Thief

Lucy Worsley returns with her new series of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history, with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to meet women who stepped outside of their ordinary lives to do extraordinary things. Together they investigate what their lives and crimes tell us about women in the past, and ask how different is it for women today? 

In this episode Lucy travels to New York to uncover the story of spirit mediums Maggie, Kate and Leah Fox. The sisters are credited with igniting the nineteenth-century Spiritualist movement, which claims that the living can contact and communicate with the dead. The craze for séances crosses class divides and Spiritualism garners millions of followers across the globe, including First Lady Mary Lincoln, Arthur Conan Doyle, and even Queen Victoria.

However, throughout their forty-year career as mediums the sisters face persistent accusations of fraud. To tease apart fact from fiction Lucy is joined by Dr Thema Bryant, past president of the American Psychological Association. A Professor in Psychology at Pepperdine University who specialises in the intersection of spirituality and psychology, Thema brings a modern lens to help understand the minds of the past. 

We visit the small hamlet where the mysterious occurrences first begin; the Fox property in snowy Hydesville, Upper New York State. Here Tracy Murphy, Director of Historic Palymra, recounts the moment when the young Fox sisters first encounter the mysterious ‘raps’ they convince others are signs from the spirit world. 

With Fox sisters expert and author Barbara Weisberg, Lucy and Thema examine how the sisters take the world by storm. They ask whether they are really audacious swindlers or the genuine founders of a spiritual movement? 

Producer: Emily Hughes 
Readers: Clare Corbett, Jonathan Keeble and Alex Phelps
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

47. Fox Sisters - Spirit Mediums

Lucy Worsley meets Minnie Pheby, a strong and agile young woman who defies all the gender stereotypes of Victorian society – not a homemaker, but a homebreaker. She’s the devil compared with the idealised ‘angel in the house’, sneaking into middle class homes in the dead of night. In West London as the Victorian era draws to a close, Minnie sleeps on a pillow of stolen dresses in a squat furnished with life’s little luxuries, all the proceeds of crime.

Lucy is joined by former Detective Chief Inspector Jackie Malton, famously the inspiration for Prime Suspect’s DCI Jane Tennison, who knows Minnie’s patch very well. She gives her expert insights on burglary, women in policing and what really makes a difference for repeat offenders like Minnie.

With historian Professor Rosalind Crone, Lucy and Jackie investigate Minnie’s past and discover if she ever hangs up her swag bag for good. Lucy and Ros test their mettle as undercover operatives in Shepherd’s Bush, staking out the house where Minnie was first arrested. Will Jackie be impressed by their efforts?

Together, the all-female team ask how common were lady burglars? How were they portrayed in the press? Why were the Victorians both appalled and fascinated by their physical capabilities and boldness?

Producer: Sarah Goodman
Readers: Clare Corbett, Jonathan Keeble and Alex Phelps
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

46. Minnie Pheby - Lady Burglar

Lucy Worsley returns with another episode of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Joined by historian Ros Crone and comedian, activist and author Deborah Frances-White, Lucy revisits the stories of women who defied societal norms through audacious crimes.

They also discuss what their own swindler names would be.

This episode focuses on Celia Cooney, the Bobbed Haired Bandit of 1920s New York; Mary Bateman, the Yorkshire Witch, whose supernatural scams turned deadly; Catharine Murphy, the Money Maker, a counterfeiter working from her kitchen table; and Annie Gordon Baillie, a serial swindler with more than 40 false names.

Through their stories, Lucy, Rosalind and Deborah explore themes of inequality, gendered justice, and the fine line between boldness and desperation while reflecting on how societal constraints push these women to extremes. 

Historian Ros Crone provides historical context on the harsh realities they face, from public dissections to burning at the stake.

The conversation also explores modern issues like the erosion of empathy in polarised debates and the lingering gaps in women’s healthcare. 

In this episode Lucy asks what drives women to break the rules - and what can their stories teach us about our life today?

Producer: Riham Moussa
Readers: Clare Corbett, Laurel Lefkow, Jonathan Keeble, Alex Phelps
Singer: Olivia Bloore
Historical Consultant: Rosalind Crone
Executive Producer: Kirsty Hunter

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

45. Bold Conversations

Lucy Worsley is back with a brand new series of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to revisit the audacious and surprising crimes of swindlers, hustlers and women on the make. Women trying to make it in a world made for men. 

In this episode Lucy is investigating the bobbed hair and flapper dresses of New York’s Jazz Age, on the heels of a 20 year old bandit, Celia Cooney. She and her husband Ed hold up local grocery stores and pharmacies in the hope of achieving a better life for their unborn child. But, as Lucy discovers, the papers quickly latch on to two key details - Celia’s stylish bobbed hair, and the fact she is a woman with a gun. 

With Lucy to explore Celia Cooney’s story is the Emmy Award winning journalist and CBS news correspondent Erin Moriarty, who gives us an insight into why the press were so enthralled by Celia, and can tell us how Celia’s New York compares to the city today. 

Lucy is also joined by historian, author and Pulitzer Prize winner Debby Applegate, who explains more about the Jazz Age - there was a dark side lurking alongside the flappers and parties. 

And in a Lady Swindlers first, Lucy speaks to Kat Palmiotti, the granddaughter of Celia Cooney, to find out how her family discovered her grandmother’s biggest secret. 

Lucy wants to know: what makes a woman like Celia Cooney, with a steady job and a baby on the way, turn to crime? And how much was the mania that surrounded her fuelled by the fact she was a woman, and one with a stylish hairstyle?

Producer: Hannah Fisher
Readers: Laurel Lefkow and Jonathan Keeble
Historical consultant: Rosalind Crone
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

44. Celia Cooney - Bobbed Haired Bandit

Lucy Worsley is back with a brand new series of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to revisit the audacious and surprising crimes of swindlers, hustlers and women on the make. Women trying to make it in a world made for men.

In this episode Lucy is exploring the life of Catharine Murphy, a single mother of three children who has a small business making counterfeit coins on her kitchen table in 1780s London. But counterfeiting money is treated by the law as treason, and for women at this time the punishment for treason is death by burning at the stake.

With Lucy to explore Catharine Murphy’s story is the broadcaster, novelist and co-host of The Rest is Money podcast Steph McGovern, who shares with Lucy her insights into the relationship women have with money and risk today.

Lucy is also joined by historian Rosalind Crone, Professor of History at the Open University. Lucy and Ros visit the former Royal Mint inside the walls of the Tower of London to look at counterfeit coins, and the site of Newgate Prison, where women condemned to death for treason suffered horrific executions.

Lucy wants to know: what made women coiners like Catharine risk an agonising death? To what extent was currency fraud a female crime then, and how much is it a female crime today? And should women with children be treated differently to other offenders by the justice system?

Producer: Jane Greenwood
Readers: Clare Corbett and Jonathan Keeble
Singer: Olivia Bloore
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4

43. Catharine Murphy - Money Maker

Lucy Worsley continues her new series of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history, with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to tail scammers, crooks, conwomen and convicts. Women from all walks of life, who find themselves on the wrong side of the law.

In this episode, Lucy is investigating Annie Gordon Baillie, a serial swindler who has over 40 aliases. She cons everyone from the milkman to government ministers.

She specialises in petty swindling but also concocts an elaborate scheme to help the crofting community on the Isle of Skye in Scotland. She promises to fund their cause, give them a voice and provide them with their own land, while pocketing any donations.
With Lucy to explore Annie Gordon Baillie’s story is author Denise Mina, who writes historical fiction, crime fiction, and graphic novels.
Lucy is also joined by historian Rosalind Crone, Professor of History at the Open University and Archivist Catherine MacPhee. Catherine paints a picture of what life was like for the crofters of Skye. Lucy and Ros visit Old Scotland Yard to find out more about a tenacious detective, Henry Marshall, who finally brings Annie to justice.

Lucy asks how did a poor, illiterate woman pass herself off as aristocracy and get away with swindling for so long? And shows that Annie’s charitable fundraising has a very dark side.

Producer: Julia Hayball
Readers: Clare Corbett, Jonathan Keeble and Alex Phelps
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

42. Annie Gordon Baillie - Serial Swindler

Lucy Worsley is back with a brand new series of Lady Swindlers, where true crime meets history - with a twist. Lucy and her team of all female detectives travel back more than a hundred years to revisit the audacious and surprising crimes of swindlers, hustlers and women on the make. Women trying to make it in a world made for men. 

In this first episode, Lucy is investigating the life of Mary Bateman who is living in Leeds in the first decade of the 19th century - a time when, despite huge leaps forward in science, many people still believe in the power of the supernatural. Mary is working as a ‘wise woman’ selling magic charms and potions, and showing off her prophetic chicken. But, as Lucy discovers, there’s a very dark side to Mary’s business too. 

With Lucy to explore Mary Bateman’s story is the writer and broadcaster Deborah Hyde, known to millions as one of the sceptical voices on the hit BBC podcast about the supernatural, Uncanny. 

Lucy is also joined by historian Rosalind Crone, Professor of History at the Open University. Lucy and Ros visit the part of Leeds where Mary lived and worked among a rapidly expanding population, and York Castle Prison where Mary’s story ends. 

Lucy wants to know if Mary Bateman believe she has special powers to heal and defeat the powers of evil - or if she's just a ruthless swindler. And what can Mary’s story tell us about women and belief in the supernatural today?

Producer: Jane Greenwood
Readers: Clare Corbett and Jonathan Keeble 
Sound design: Chris Maclean
Executive producer: Kirsty Hunter 

A StoryHunter production for BBC Radio 4.

41. Mary Bateman - Yorkshire Witch

Lucy talks to fellow historian Greg Jenner about "larking about" on the TV show Horrible Histories, how to triumph at a Tudor history quiz (visit a museum on the subject first!), working with your idols (Stephen Fry) and the process and extraordinary detail that goes into making You're Dead To Me.
 
You can listen to Greg's podcast by searching for You're Dead To Me on BBC Sounds or wherever you get your podcasts.

Bonus episode: Lucy Worsley talks to Greg Jenner

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