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The Lawfare Institute

The Lawfare Podcast features discussions with experts, policymakers, and opinion leaders at the nexus of national security, law, and policy. On issues from foreign policy, homeland security, intelligence, and cybersecurity to governance and law, we have doubled down on seriousness at a time when others are running away from it. Visit us at www.lawfareblog.com.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

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The Lawfare Podcast

This week, Scott sat down with old and new Lawfare colleagues—Benjamin Wittes, Renée DiResta, and Michael Feinberg—to talk through the week’s big national security news stories, including:

 • “An Old Fashioned Anti Raid.” Former Trump National Security Advisor (turned Trump critic) John Bolton got a rude awakening this past week when the FBI conducted a raid at his home, reportedly on the grounds that he is believed to have retained classified information from his time in office. It’s the latest in a recent spate of (well publicized) investigations targeting Trump’s critics and enemies, including a series of mortgage fraud investigations into Federal Reserve governor Lisa Cook (who Trump now purports to have removed for cause), New York Attorney General Letitia James (which coincided with a photo shoot that Justice Department official Ed Martin did, uninvited, outside of her home), and Senator Adam Schiff. How big a threat are such investigations to Trump’s enemies? And what will their long-term implications be for the Justice Department?
 • “Uncleared and Present Danger.” Last week, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard pulled security clearances from 37 current and former intelligence officials on the purported grounds that they had “abused the public trust by politicizing and manipulating intelligence, leaking classified intelligence without authorization, and/or committing intentional egregious violations of tradecraft standards.” Those affected range from current senior intelligence officials to former officials who have been out of government for years to current senior congressional staffers. What are the consequences likely to be of Gabbard’s actions and what does it show about the Trump administration’s approach to national security agencies?
 • “Blue Sky Thinking.” In response to a state law mandating age verification for anyone seeking to use social media platforms, Bluesky has opted to shut down its services in the state of Mississippi. What does this sort of response tell us about the trajectory of state and federal regulations, and what the impact might ultimately be on the internet?

In Object Lessons, Ben is letting The Algorithm light his way—literally—with solar-powered sunflower lights. Renée, not to be outdone, also bows before our algorithmic overlord and wants you to stream Red Bull’s YouTube dance battles. Scott is using his green thumb to plant the seeds of some versatile green fruit. And Michael is going less horticultural, more horrifying, by planting horror movie props around his house—because nothing says “I love you” like a severed head in the fridge.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

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Rational Security: The “Room Raider” Edition

Matthew Ford, Associate Professor at Swedish Defence University and author of “War in the Smartphone Age: Conflict, Connectivity, and the Crises at Our Fingertips,” joins Lawfare’s Justin Sherman to discuss the role of smartphones and related technologies in war, how social media contributes to a collapse of context in the war content we see online, and how smartphones and other devices are reshaping open-source intelligence (OSINT) and open-source investigations (OSINV) vis-a-vis conflicts and violence from Syria to Ethiopia to Ukraine. They also discuss the tech stack in war, how the military “kill chain” is evolving with ever-greater digital connectivity, the current state and future of “participatory warfare,” and how we can become better consumers—and sharers—of war-related content online.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Lawfare Daily: ‘War in the Smartphone Age,’ with Matthew Ford

Lawfare Contributor Mykhailo Soldatenko sits down with Michael O'Hanlon, Director of Foreign Policy Research and Senior Fellow at the Brookings Institution, and Andriy Zagorodnyuk, Chairman of the Centre for Defence Strategies in Kyiv, a former Ukrainian Defence Minister, and a nonresident scholar at Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, to discuss ways of defending Ukraine from present and future Russian attacks in the absence of NATO membership.

Please see the following policy proposals relevant to the discussion: 

 • “
Defending Ukraine in the Absence of NATO Security Guarantees • ,” by Paul B. Stares and Michael O'Hanlon
 • “
Ukraine's New Theory of Victory Should be Strategic Neutralization • ,” by Andriy Zagorodnyuk
 • “
Exploring Ukraine’s Armed Neutrality or Nonalignment: Legal and Policy Considerations • ,” by Mykhailo Soldatenko

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Lawfare Daily: Defending Ukraine Outside NATO with Michael O'Hanlon and Andriy Zagorodnyuk

In a live conversation on YouTube, Lawfare Editor in Chief Benjamin Wittes sat down with Lawfare Senior Editors Anna Bower, and Roger Parloff, and Lawfare contributor James Pearce to discuss the FBI’s execution of a search warrant at John Bolton’s house, a federal judge ruling that Alina Habba was unlawfully serving as a U.S. attorney for New Jersey, Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s motion to dismiss his indictment for selective prosecution and his return to Maryland, a decision voiding the fine in the civil fraud case against President Trump, the Supreme Court’s ruling in NIH v. APHA, and more.You can find information on legal challenges to Trump administration actions here. And check out Lawfare’s new homepage on the litigation, new Bluesky account, and new WITOAD merch.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

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Lawfare Daily: The Trials of the Trump Administration, Aug. 22

From August 1, 2024: Anastasiia Lapatina is a Kyiv-based Ukraine Fellow at Lawfare. Marcel Plichta is a Fellow at the Centre for Global Law and Governance at the University of St. Andrews, and a former analyst at the U.S. Department of Defense who currently works as an instructor at the Grey Dynamics Intelligence School. 

For this episode, Lapatina sat down with Plichta to discuss Ukraine’s ongoing drone campaign against Russia, Ukraine’s choice of targets deep inside Russian territory, and the future of drone warfare around the world.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Lawfare Archive: Inside Ukraine’s Drone Campaign Against Russia

From May 3, 2024: Over the past several years, governors around the country from both political parties have used their respective National Guards for an increasingly unconventional array of domestic missions, ranging from teaching in public schools to regulating immigration at the southern border. To discuss how this trend may impact the National Guard—and our broader democracy, particularly in this pivotal election year—Lawfare Senior Editor Scott R. Anderson recently sat down with a panel of senior former National Guard and Defense Department officials, including: General Craig McKinley, General Joseph Lengyel, Brigadier General Allyson Solomon, Major General Daryl Bohac, and former Assistant Secretary of Defense Dr. Paul Stockton. 

A video recording of the panel is available at https://www.brookings.edu/events/domestic-deployment-of-the-national-guard/. 

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Lawfare Archive: Domestic Deployment of the National Guard

For today's episode, Lawfare Senior Editor and General Counsel Scott R. Anderson sits down with Lawfare Contributing Editor and Indiana University Maurer School of Law professor Asaf Lubin and Hebrew University of Jerusalem professor Deborah Housen-Couriel to talk over the European Court of Human Rights' recent decision in Ukraine and the Netherlands v. Russia.

Together, they discuss how the opinion lays new ground in discussing digital rights in wartime, what issues still need to be developed further, and what it all might mean for warfare in the future, both good and bad.

For more, read Asaf and Deb’s latest piece on Lawfare, “Digital Rights in Armed Conflict and the Ukraine v. Russia Decision.”

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Lawfare Daily: The European Court of Human Rights Takes on Digital Rights in War, with Asaf Lubin and Deb Housen-Couriel

Alan Rozenshtein, Research Director at Lawfare, sits down with Sam Winter-Levy, a Fellow in the Technology and International Affairs Program at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; Janet Egan, a Senior Fellow with the Technology and National Security Program at the Center for a New American Security; and Peter Harrell, a Nonresident Fellow at Carnegie and a former Senior Director for International Economics at the White House National Security Council under President Joe Biden.

They discuss the Trump administration’s recent decision to allow U.S. companies Nvidia and AMD to export a range of advanced AI semiconductors to China in exchange for a 15% payment to the U.S. government. They talk about the history of the export control regime targeting China’s access to AI chips, the strategic risks of allowing China to acquire powerful chips like the Nvidia H20, and the potential harm to the international coalition that has worked to restrict China’s access to this technology. They also debate the statutory and constitutional legality of the deal, which appears to function as an export tax, a practice explicitly prohibited by the Constitution.

Mentioned in this episode:

The Financial Times article breaking the news about the Nvidia dealThe Trump Administration’s AI Action Plan
Find Scaling Laws on the Lawfare website, and subscribe to never miss an episode.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

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Scaling Laws: Export Controls: Janet Egan, Sam Winter-Levy, and Peter Harrell on the White House's Semiconductor Decision

This week, Scott sat down with his colleagues Anna Bower, Chris Mirasola, and Mykhailo Soldatenko to talk through the week’s big national security news, including:

 • “Wings and a Prayer.” The Ukraine conflict has been the subject of intense shuttle diplomacy over the past week, as President Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin flew to a meeting in Alaska last Friday, only for Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy and a cadre of European leaders to fly to Washington, DC, to meet with Trump yesterday at the White House. What do we know about their conversations? And could this be a turning point in the conflict?
 • “Capital Offense.” It’s been more than a week since President Trump chose to make law enforcement in Washington, DC—a city he has derided as “taken over by violent gangs and bloodthirsty criminals”—a national priority, by deploying hundreds of National Guard personnel and federal law enforcement officers to the streets and seeking to assert federal control over the police department, in ways that triggered a legal challenge by the city. What is motivating this major policy effort? And where does it seem likely to lead?
 • “The Ep Files: I Want to Believe.” The Trump administration is reportedly installing a new “co-”deputy director at the FBI, in part because of controversy the current incumbent—former right-wing radio host Dan Bongino—has courted relating to the release of the so-called “Epstein Files.” And it’s indicative of the major problems that these files—and the potential that they may say something about President Trump’s relationship with the notorious sex offender for whom they are named—are causing President Trump and his administration. What’s driving this rare point of dissent among the president’s core supporters? And what ramifications could it have for our justice system?

In object lessons, Anna hyped a new Kelce brothers podcast episode that featured some girl that Travis is dating. Chris recommended a crafty parenting hack: taking your kid to Michael’s for some unplugged, creative fun. Scott channeled his inner influencer, telling you where you can find the newest, hippest dog shirts. And Mykhailo brought us back down to Earth with a recommendation of Timothy Snyder’s YouTube series, The Making of Modern Ukraine, for a dive into the context and real causes for the Russia-Ukraine conflict.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Rational Security: The “Whole Etsy Store of Horrors” Edition

Adam Chan, National Security Counsel at the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) and inaugural Director of the FCC’s new Council on National Security, joins Lawfare’s Justin Sherman to discuss the FCC’s rulemaking on submarine cables and national security. They discuss the FCC’s new submarine cable rules, the role of submarine cables in the U.S. telecommunications supply chain and in the data and AI era, and the national security risks facing submarine cable infrastructure. They also discuss new requirements for submarine cable license applicants to make physical security and cybersecurity certifications, the objective of limiting Chinese influence on U.S.-tied submarine cables, and the future of how the FCC is thinking about threats, responses, and engagement with industry to address them.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

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Lawfare Daily: FCC’s New Submarine Cable Rules with Adam Chan

Robert Mahari, a joint JD-PhD candidate at the MIT Media Lab and Harvard Law School, joins Kevin Frazier, Assistant Professor at St. Thomas University College of Law and a Tarbell Fellow at Lawfare, to explain how increased use of AI agents may lead humans to form troublingly and even addictive relationships with artificial systems. Robert also shares the significance of his research on common uses of existing generative AI systems. This interview builds on Robert’s recent piece in the MIT Tech Review, which he co-authored with Pat Pataranutaporn.

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/c/trumptrials.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.

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Lawfare Daily: Robert Mahari on Addictive Intelligence, Digital Attachment Disorders, and Other AI-related Concerns

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