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Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher

Freakonomics co-author Steve Levitt tracks down other high achievers for surprising, revealing conversations about their lives and obsessions. Join Levitt as he goes through the most interesting midlife crisis you’ve ever heard — and learn how a renegade sheriff is transforming Chicago's jail, how a biologist is finding the secrets of evolution in the Arctic tundra, and how a trivia champion memorized 160,000 flashcards.

To get every show in our network without ads and a monthly bonus episode of Freakonomics Radio, sign up for SiriusXM Podcasts+ on Apple Podcasts at http://apple.co/SiriusXM.

People I (Mostly) Admire

How psychologist Dan Gilbert went from high school dropout to Harvard professor, found the secret of joy, and inspired Steve Levitt's divorce.

 

SOURCE:Daniel Gilbert • , professor of psychology at Harvard University.

 

RESOURCES: • "
What the Data Says (and Doesn’t Say) About Crime in the United States • ," by John Gramlich (Pew Research Center, 2020).
Enlightenment Now: The Case for Reason, Science, Humanism, and Progress • , by Stephen Pinker (2018).
 • "
Mistakenly Seeking Solitude • ," by Nicholas Epley and Juliana Schroeder (
Journal of Experimental Psychology • , 2014).
 • "
Just Think: The Challenges of the Disengaged Mind • ," by Timothy D. Wilson, David A. Reinhard, Erin C. Westgate, Daniel T. Gilbert, Nicole Ellerbeck, Cheryl Hahn, Casey L. Brown, and Adi Shaked (
Science • , 2013).
 • "
The End of History Illusion • ," by Jordi Quoidbach, Daniel T. Gilbert, and Timothy D. Wilson (
Science • , 2013).
Happy Money: The Science of Smarter Spending • , by Elizabeth Dunn (2013).
 • "
If Money Doesn't Make You Happy Then You Probably Aren't Spending It Right • ," by Elizabeth W. Dunn, Daniel T. Gilbert, and Timothy D. Wilson (
Journal of Consumer Psychology • , 2011).
This Emotional Life • , by Daniel Gilbert (2010).
Stumbling on Happiness • , by Dan Gilbert (2006).
 • "
Affective Forecasting • ," by Timothy D. Wilson and Daniel T. Gilbert (
Advances in Experimental Social Psychology • , 2003).

 

EXTRAS: • "
Drawing from Life (and Death) • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2023).
 • "
Who Gives the Worst Advice? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).
 • "
Sendhil Mullainathan Thinks Messing Around Is the Best Use of Your Time • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).
 • "
Am I Boring You? • " by 
Freakonomics Radio • (2015).

Turning Work into Play (Update)

In her book, Rumbles, medical historian Elsa Richardson explores the history of the human gut. She talks with Steve about dubious medical practices, gruesome tales of survival, and the things that medieval doctors may have gotten right.

 

SOURCE:Elsa Richardson • , medical historian at the University of Strathclyde.

 

RESOURCES:Rumbles: A Curious History of the Gut: The Secret Story of the Body's Most Fascinating Organ • , by Elsa Richardson (2024).
Michael Levitt retirement speech • (2024).
 • "
Was There Really a Hawthorne Effect at the Hawthorne Plant? An Analysis of the Original Illumination Experiments • ," by Steven D. Levitt and John A. List (
NBER Working Paper, • 2009).
 • "
Floating Stools — Flatus versus Fat • ," by Michael D. Levitt and William C. Duane (
The New England Journal of Medicine, • 1972).
 • "
Factors Influencing Pulmonary Methane Excretion in Man • ," by John H. Bond, Rolf R. Engel, and Michael D. Levitt (
Journal of Experimental Medicine, • 1971).
The Expression of the Emotions in Man and Animals, • by Charles Darwin (1872).
The Levitt Lab Founding School Leader • , job listing.
The Levitt Lab • , information page.

 

EXTRAS: • "
An Update on the Khan World School • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2023).
 • “
Is This the Future of High School? • ” by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2022).
 • “
Sal Khan: ‘If It Works for 15 Cousins, It Could Work for a Billion People • ,'” by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).
 • "
The Power of Poop • ," by 
Freakonomics Radio • (2011).

147. Is Your Gut a Second Brain?

Sarah Stein Greenberg runs Stanford’s d.school, which teaches design as a mode of problem solving. She and Steve talk about what makes her field different from other academic disciplines, how to approach hard problems, and why brainstorms are so annoying.

 

SOURCE:Sarah Stein Greenberg • , executive director of the Hasso Plattner Institute of Design at Stanford University.

 

RESOURCES:Creative Acts for Curious People: How to Think, Create, and Lead in Unconventional Ways • , by Sarah Stein Greenberg (2021).
Noora Health • .
Civilla • .
Substantial • .
Rare • .
Sarah Stein Greenberg wildlife photography • .

 

EXTRAS: • "
Feeling Sound and Hearing Color • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Why Are Boys and Men in Trouble? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
What’s Impacting American Workers? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Richard Dawkins on God, Genes, and Murderous Baby Cuckoos • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
The World’s Most Controversial Ornithologist • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
How PETA Made Radical Ideas Mainstream • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Pay Attention! (Your Body Will Thank You) • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
How to Have Great Conversations • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Suleika Jaouad’s Survival Mechanisms • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Daron Acemoglu on Economics, Politics, and Power • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2024).
 • "
Nobel Laureate Claudia Goldin on 'Greedy Work' and the Wage Gap • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2023).
 • "
A Rockstar Chemist and Her Cancer-Attacking 'Lawn Mower • ,'" by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2022).
 • "
Daniel Kahneman on Why Our Judgment is Flawed — and What to Do About It • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).
 • "
Why Is Richard Thaler Such a ****ing Optimist? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).

148. How to Have Good Ideas

Sarah Hart investigates the mathematical structures underlying musical compositions and literature. Using examples from Monteverdi to Lewis Carroll, Sarah explains to Steve how math affects how we hear music and understand stories. 

 

SOURCE:Sarah Hart • , professor emerita of mathematics at the University of London.

 

RESOURCES:Once Upon a Prime: The Wondrous Connections Between Mathematics and Literature, • by Sarah Hart (2023).
 • "
Ahab's Arithmetic: The Mathematics of Moby-Dick • ," by Sarah B. Hart (
Journal of Humanistic Mathematics, • 2021).
 • "
Online Lecture: The Mathematics of Musical Composition • ," by Sarah Hart (Gresham College, 2020).
Black Mirror: Bandersnatch, • film (2018).
The Luminaries: A Novel, • by Eleanor Catton (2013).
Not Quite What I Was Planning: Six-Word Memoirs by Writers Famous and Obscure, • edited by Rachel Fershleiser and Larry Smith (2008).
Les Revenentes, • by Georges Perec (1972).
A Void, • by Georges Perec (1969).
Cent Mille Milliards de Poèmes, • by Raymond Queneau (1961).
Through the Looking-Glass, and What Alice Found There, • by Lewis Carroll (1871).
Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, • by Lewis Carroll (1865).
OuLiPo • .

 

EXTRAS: • "
The Joy of Math With Sarah Hart • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2023).
 • "
Mathematician Sarah Hart on Why Numbers are Music to Our Ears • ," by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2021).

Why Numbers are Music to Our Ears (Update)

Jonathan Levin is an academic economist who now runs one of the most influential universities in the world. He tells Steve how he saved Comcast a billion dollars, why he turned down Steve’s unusual pitch to come to the University of Chicago, and why being a nice guy makes him a better college president.

 

SOURCE • :
Jonathan Levin • , president of Stanford University. 

 

RESOURCES: • "
Income Segregation and Intergenerational Mobility Across Colleges in the United States • ," by Raj Chetty, John N Friedman, Emmanuel Saez, Nicholas Turner, and Danny Yagan (
The Quarterly Journal of Economics, • 2020).
 • "
Jonathan Levin: The Most Recent John Bates Clark Medal Winner • ," by Steve Levitt (
Freakonomics Blog, • 2011).
 • "
Winning Play in Spectrum Auctions • ," by Jeremy Bulow, Jonathan Levin, and Paul Milgrom (
NBER Working Paper, • 2009).
 • "
Information and Competition in U.S. Forest Service Timber Auctions • ," by Susan Athey and Jonathan Levin (
Journal of Political Economy, • 2001).

 

EXTRAS:Vintage Pokémon card pack Instagram video • , by Tyler Thrasher (2025).
 • "
Higher Education Is Broken. Can It Be Fixed? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2023).
 • "
How Much Are the Right Friends Worth? • " by 
People I (Mostly) Admire • (2022).

149. Stanford’s President Knows He Can’t Make Everyone Happy

Steve Levitt has spent decades as an academic economist, “studying strange phenomena and human behavior in weird circumstances.” Now he’s turning his curiosity to something new: interviewing some of the most interesting, unorthodox people around — from actresses to athletes, authors to inventors. Here is a preview of Levitt’s new podcast, which premieres August 21st. New episodes every two weeks. “People I (Mostly) Admire” is a production of the Freakonomics Radio Network.

Introducing “People I (Mostly) Admire”

By cataloging the steady march of human progress, the Harvard psychologist and linguist has become a very public intellectual. But the self-declared “polite Canadian” has managed to enrage people on opposite ends of the political spectrum. Steve Levitt tries to understand why.

1. Steven Pinker: "I Manage My Controversy Portfolio Carefully”

She’s best known for playing neurobiologist Amy Farrah Fowler on The Big Bang Theory, but the award-winning actress has a rich life outside of her acting career, as a teacher, mother — and a real-life neuroscientist. Steve Levitt tries to learn more about this one-time academic and Hollywood non-conformist, who is both very similar to him and also quite his opposite.

2. Mayim Bialik: “I Started Crying When I Realized How Beautiful the Universe Is”

The dean of Yale’s School of Management grew up in a small village in Guyana. During his unlikely journey, he has researched video-gaming habits, communicable disease, and why so many African-Americans haven’t had the kind of success he’s had. Steve Levitt talks to Charles about his parents’ encouragement, his love of Sports Illustrated, and how he talks to his American-born kids about the complicated history of Blackness in America.

3. Kerwin Charles: “One Does Not Know Where an Insight Will Come From”

It was only in his late twenties that America’s favorite brainiac began to seriously embrace his love of trivia. Now he holds the “Greatest of All Time” title on Jeopardy! Steve Levitt digs into how he trained for the show, what it means to have a "geographic memory," and why we lie to our children.

1. Steven Pinker: "I Manage My Controversy Portfolio Carefully”

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