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WNYC Studios

The Peabody Award-winning On the Media podcast is your guide to examining how the media sausage is made. Hosts Brooke Gladstone and Micah Loewinger examine threats to free speech and government transparency, cast a skeptical eye on media coverage of the week’s big stories and unravel hidden political narratives in everything we read, watch and hear.

On the Media

The federal government shutdown has entered its fourth week. On this week’s On the Media, hear about the man who is laying off four thousand federal workers this month, whom some call a “shadow president.” Plus, a white nationalist influencer reveals how fast the Republican party is shifting right. 

[02:21] Host Brooke Gladstone sits down with Andy Kroll, a reporter covering justice and the rule of law at ProPublica, to discuss Russell Vought, the director of a little-known, but powerful office inside the White House. 

[20:23] Host Micah Loewinger speaks with Ben Lorber, a senior research analyst at Political Research Associates, about his work tracking Nick Fuentes, the Gen Z white nationalist influencer, since 2019 – and why he’s not convinced that Fuentes is as powerful as he claims to be.

[38:13] Host Micah Loewinger called up Gregorio Olivares Gutierrez, a junior and student journalist at the University of Texas, Dallas, to talk about the turmoil between campus newsrooms and their administrations over covering student protests.

Further reading / listening:

 • “
The Shadow President • ,” by Andy Kroll
Safety through Solidarity: A Radical Guide to Fighting Antisemitism, by Shane Burley and Ben Lorber

 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Donald Trump's 'Darth Vader.' Plus, the Normalization of White Nationalist Nick Fuentes.

This summer, Republicans clawed back over a billion dollars that had been pledged to public media. But it wasn’t until this month that the corporation for public broadcasting – longtime distributor of that money – started to wind down operations, and those federal funds finally ran out. 

Now, many stations are weighing whether to spend their shrinking budgets on national programming from the likes of NPR, or to fund journalism on their local communities. We’re affected, too. So begins a new reckoning to save not just individual stations, but the interconnected system that makes public radio so special.

LaFontaine E. Oliver is the president, CEO and executive chair of New York Public Radio. This week -- which is also WNYC pledge week -- he tells Brooke about how federal cuts are changing public media, and how our station is facing this critical moment.

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

How Funding Cuts Are Changing Public Radio

Tech giants Apple and Google have been quietly removing ways for citizens to document The United States Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s activities. On this week’s On the Media, one group’s efforts to make sure citizens can see what ICE is doing. Plus, the online right-wing campaign that led a historian to flee the country. 

[01:00] Host Micah Loewinger speaks with Joseph Cox, co-founder of 404 Media, about the Trump administration’s pressure campaign to get rid of apps that document ICE activities, including one that archives videos of ICE abuses, and why these apps could matter for future ICE accountability.

[15:34] Host Micah Loewinger speaks with Mark Bray, historian and author of Antifa: The Anti-Fascist Handbook, who left the country after being accused of being “antifa,” resulting in death threats and doxxing. Bray, a professor at Rutgers University, shares how his research is helping him to understand the harassment campaign led by conservative media against him.

[31:51] Host Brooke Gladstone called up John J. Lennon, contributing editor for Esquire, at Sing Sing Correctional Facility, where he’s serving the 24th year of his 28-year-to-life sentence for murder, drug sales, and gun possession. He recently wrote the book, The Tragedy of True Crime: Four Guilty Men and the Stories That Define Us, and discusses the impact of the genre on people serving time and why he wants to rewrite typical true crime narratives. 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Big Tech is Silencing the ICE Watchers. Plus, Why a Scholar of Antifa Fled the Country.

For decades, the United States backed efforts to achieve a two-state solution—in which Israel would exist side by side with the Palestinian state, with both states recognizing each other’s claim to contested territory. The veteran negotiators Hussein Agha, representing Palestine, and Robert Malley, an American diplomat, played instrumental roles in that long effort, including the critical Camp David summit of 2000. But, in their new book, “Tomorrow Is Yesterday,” they conclude that they were part of a charade. There was never any way that a two-state solution could satisfy either of the parties, Agha and Malley tell The New Yorker Radio Hour's David Remnick in an interview. “A waste of time is almost a charitable way to look at it,” Malley notes bitterly. “At the end of that thirty-year-or-so period, the Israelis and Palestinians are in a worse situation than before the U.S. got so heavily invested.” The process, appealing to Western leaders and liberals in Israel, was geared to “find the kind of solutions that have a technical outcome, that are measurable, and that can be portrayed by lines on maps,” Agha says. “It completely discarded the issue of emotions and history. You can’t be emotional. You have to be rational. You have to be cool. But rational and cool has nothing to do with the conflict.”

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

David Remnick: How The Two State Solution Ended in Disaster

The Supreme Court has returned to the bench and is poised to hear major cases on tariffs and federal firings. On this week’s On the Media, how a century-old legal theory may help us understand how the highest court handles Trump’s second administration. Plus, meet the Ellisons, who are buying up American media like the Vanderbilts collected railroads.

[02:26] Host Brooke Gladstone speaks with Greg Sargent, a staff writer at The New Republic and the host of the podcast “The Daily Blast,” on Stephen Miller’s plan to normalize President Trump’s authoritarian moves.

[13:37] Host Brooke Gladstone sits down with Pema Levy, a reporter at Mother Jones, to discuss a theory on the two-track justice system in Nazi Germany, and why one justice is warning that the U.S. Supreme Court could recreate it.

[34:54] Host Micah Loewinger speaks with Jake Lahut, a reporter for Wired covering the White House, about the Ellison family–America’s newest media magnates–and what their reign might mean for all of us.

Further reading / listening:

 • “
Inside Stephen Miller’s Secret Plan to Normalize Trump’s Dictator Rule, • ” by Greg Sargent
 • “
The ‘Dual State’ Theory Was Invented to Describe Nazis. The Supreme Court Could Take Us There • ,” by Pema Levy
 • “
Larry Ellison Is a ‘Shadow President’ in Donald Trump’s America • ,” by Jake Lahut

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Authoritarianism, but Make It Look Normal. Plus, the Family Taking Over American Media.

This week, “Monster: The Ed Gein Story” is the most watched show on Netflix. It’s a dramatized retelling of the life of the serial killer who inspired “Psycho” and “The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.” The “Monster” franchise, which includes two earlier seasons about Jeffrey Dahmer and Lyle and Erik Menendez, is one of Netflix’s splashiest hits – the Dahmer season is still the fourth-most viewed English language show in the history of the platform. And the true crime obsession only grows each year. On Netflix last year, 15 of the top 20 documentaries were true crime docs, compared to just six in 2020. 

But what does it mean for the subjects of these documentaries, that Americans endlessly crave stories about murder and bloodshed and terror? John J. Lennon is a contributing editor for Esquire and writes frequently for New York Review of Books and the New York Times. This week, he spoke to host Brooke Gladstone from Sing Sing Correctional Facility, where he’s serving his 24th year of his 28-year-to-life sentence for murder, drug sales, and gun possession. They spoke about his new book, The Tragedy of True Crime, what it was like to watch himself get featured in a true crime documentary, and why he wants to upend the typical 'true crime' narratives of good vs. evil. 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

What's Wrong with True Crime?

This week, President Trump said he plans to use the military against America's "enemy within." On this week’s On the Media, how Trump’s rhetoric can obscure the real limits to his powers. Plus, how Humphrey Bogart betrayed the ideals of his most celebrated film.

[01:00] Host Micah Loewinger sits down for an extended conversation with Jamelle Bouie, columnist at The New York Times. They unpack the unprecedented Quantico meeting, the importance of keeping an eye on history, and why Trump’s mental decline seems to go uncovered by the political press. Plus, a defense of name-calling.

[38:26] Host Brooke Gladstone speaks with Corey Robin, distinguished professor of political science at Brooklyn College and author of Fear: The History of a Political Idea, on how free speech crackdowns can change our political culture and tear at the fabric of the soul. Plus, how Humphrey Bogart betrayed the ideals of his most celebrated film.

Further reading / listening:

“‘The Most Epic Political Victory Our Country Has Ever Seen’ Is Nothing of the Kind” • , by Jamelle Bouie
Fear: The History of a Political Idea, • by Corey Robin

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Jamelle Bouie Says Your Fear of Trump Isn't Helping. Plus, Humphrey Bogart’s Betrayal.

This week in Uganda, the pop star-turned-politician Bobi Wine released his election manifesto to win the presidency in 2026. The current leader, Yoweri Museveni, has held power in Uganda since 1986 and is seeking his seventh term.

Last year, Brooke spoke with Bobi Wine and Moses Bwayo, a co-director of the Oscar-nominated documentary Bobi Wine: The People's President. They discussed Bobi’s first bid for the presidency, the brutal backlash he has faced alongside his supporters, and why it's important for the world to pay attention to what's happening in Uganda.

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Bobi Wine: The People's President

President Trump has declared that Tylenol should not be used during pregnancy. On this week’s On the Media, how funding cuts and disputed claims linking the drug to autism have sent scientists reeling. Plus, how the religious right are processing the death of Charlie Kirk.

[01:00] Host Brooke Gladstone sits down with John Tuthill, neurobiology and biophysics professor at the University of Washington, describes the state of scientific research under Donald Trump, and how it feels to review grant proposals “while the system is burning.”

[15:52] Host Micah Loewinger speaks with Josh Keating, senior correspondent at Vox, on how the Trump administration is combining the “war on terror” with the “war on drugs.” 

[33:48] Host Brooke Gladstone talks with Matthew D. Taylor, senior Christian scholar at the Institute for Islamic, Christian and Jewish Studies in Baltimore, about how Charlie Kirk has been memorialized as a saint and a martyr by the religious right, and what it means.

Further reading / listening:

 • “
Fear and loathing on study section: Reviewing grant proposals while the system is burning • ,” by John Tuthill
 • “
What happens when Trump combines the war on drugs with the war on terror • ,” by Josh Keating
“Inside Charlie Kirk's Memorial: A Deep Dive into Christian Nationalism and Political Polarization,” • by Bradley Onishi, Straight White American Jesus Podcast

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Trump v. Tylenol. Plus, How Charlie Kirk Became a Martyr for the Christian Right.

Joseph and Shirley Wershba, worked at CBS news back in the good ol' days. In 1948, along with Edward R. Murrow, Joe Wershba helped produce the CBS’s first salvo against McCarthyism. Brooke spoke to Joe and his wife Shirley in 2005 about the film "Good Night, and Good Luck," which was partly based on their life.

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

Goodnight, and Good Luck: 20 Years Later

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