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WNYC Studios

On the Media is a weekly show that uses the media as a lens to understand our world. On the Media listeners say the show is an essential companion, helping them survive the firehose of media coming at them 24/7. Hosted by Brooke Gladstone and Micah Loewinger, the show does not do ‘hot takes’, instead offering listeners context, historical parallels, media analysis and often a much appreciated deep exhale. On the Media hosts have an eye on the nuances and details regularly missed by other outlets which helps listeners understand where they should be paying attention (and what they can afford to ignore). Our media diets have untruths woven in, and inconvenient truths left out. These are the bits explored every week at On the Media.

On the Media

At the outset of the war with Iran, Brooke Gladstone spoke to Wes J. Bryant, a former senior policy advisor at the Pentagon and retired Air Force Master Sergeant, about the civilian protection initiative he was working on for the Department of Defense and the deadly consequences of Secretary Hegseth’s decisions to close it down.

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The New Rules Of War Are There Are No Rules

AI researchers are warning that the technology they’re creating could kill us all. On this week’s On the Media, unpacking the feverish debate over the dangers of artificial intelligence. Plus, why people find AI chatbots more convincing than their fellow humans.

[01:00] Brooke Gladstone interviews Joshua Rothman, staff writer at The New Yorker, about the competing narratives around AI, which maximize its power on the one hand and minimize it on the other, and how both sides risk misunderstanding the technology and what to do about it. 

[21:38] Micah Loewinger speaks with Jason Koebler, investigative reporter and co-founder of 404 Media, about the A.I. marketing tactic that’s bombarded Reddit, and why AEO, not SEO, is changing the internet’s future. 

[36:05] Micah Loewinger chats with Kai Kupferschmidt, contributing writer for Science, about the growing body of research showing that chatbots can be as, if not more, persuasive than people. 

Further reading / watching:

 • “
Can A.I. ‘Go Rogue’? • ” by Joshua Rothman
 • “
Companies Are Using Reddit to Manipulate ChatGPT and Google AI Search • ” by Jason Koebler
 • “
It Is Trivially Easy to Use Reddit to Manipulate AI Search, Research Suggests • ,” by Jason Koebler
 • “
Powers of persuasion: AI chatbots are becoming experts at changing people’s minds. What gives them an edge? • ” by Kai Kupferschmidt

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

How Extinction Entered the AI Debate

The hit HBO series, How To With John Wilson was huge when it came out during the pandemic, 2020. Wilson begins each episode with a sort of mundane premise like how to split a check with your friends or how to properly throw out batteries, and then cleverly deviates from the idea, inserting delightful and strange interactions filmed on New York’s sidewalks and his poetic narration on city life and beyond.

After wrapping 3 seasons of the show, Wilson has a new project, again focused on infrastructure, a feature length movie, titled The History of Concrete, which comes to theaters September 18th. Micah called him up to talk about the state of the documentary industry and the arduous journey behind making the film.

 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

How To Make A Documentary, With John Wilson

I.C.E. agents have targeted Springfield, Ohio since Haitians lost Temporary Protected Status. On this week’s On the Media, a reporter from The Haitian Times describes the culture of fear that has ensued. Plus, how did AI chatbots end up in public school classrooms?

[01:00] Brooke Gladstone interviews Wedly Cazy, a reporter for the Haitian Times, who has been closely covering the Haitian community in Springfield, Ohio, as immigration officials have descended on the area following the end of temporary protected status. 

[19:54] Micah Loewinger speaks with Julia Angwin, investigative journalist and founder of Proof News, on a massive settlement between Meta and dozens of states over claims that Facebook and Instagram harm kids, and why the deal might not bring about real change. 

[34:57] OTM producer Molly Rosen speaks with Jessica Winter, staff writer at the New Yorker, about how AI tools have infiltrated schools and what the research says about the impact of AI use on cognitive development.

Further reading / watching:

 • “
Roadside stops, foot chases and children in hiding as ICE operations intensify in Springfield • ,” by Wedly Cazy
 • “
Family: Ankle monitor distressed Haitian man killed by tanker truck in Springfield, • ” by Wedly Cazy
 • “
As Meta Enters Its Zombie Era, Every Blow Counts • ,” by Julia Angwin
 • “
What Will It Take to Get A.I. Out of Schools? • ” by Jessica Winter

 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Haitians Live in a Dual State in Ohio Right Now

On last week's show we devoted a segment to the plague of online influencers making endorsement videos for politicians in exchange for money, but we wanted to hear from a creator's perspective. Host Micah Loewinger sat down with Dave Jorgenson, who, until last year, made videos at the Washington Post where he grew the paper’s TikTok account to nearly 2 million followers. Now he has his own media outlet, called Local News International and his videos cover pretty much anything and everything that makes headlines. This is the extented cut of their conversation.
 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Dave Jorgenson on Politics in the Influencer Age

Defense secretary Pete Hegseth is demanding what he calls “more patriotic” coverage of his cabinet. On this week’s On the Media, hear how the Pentagon is cracking down on its publication, Stars and Stripes. Plus, an investigation reveals that some online content creators have taken money to endorse politicians.

[01:00] Brooke Gladstone interviews Max Lederer, the publisher of Stars and Stripes, the independent, award-winning military news outlet within the Defense Department, about the Pentagon’s terminations of himself, the editor-in-chief, and the Middle East reporter, and the agency’s continued attacks on the paper’s congressionally mandated editorial independence. 

[13:38] Brooke speaks with Paul Waldman, writer of the Substack newsletter, The Cross Section, about how the media attention on Trump’s aide Natalie Harp, also known as “the human printer,” exploded. Plus, how she went from Fox News guest in 2019 to primary shaper of the president’s media consumption. 

[27:24] Micah sits down with Ken Bensinger, a New York Times media and politics reporter, to talk about his recent investigation into how hundreds of social media content creators are being paid to boost politicians ahead of elections, and not always disclosing it. Plus, Dave Jorgenson, former video producer at the Washington Post and founder of Local News International, speaks to the necessity of adopting standards around things political endorsements and AI use on social media, and how he’s using short-form videos to combat misinformation on the platforms where it flourishes. 

Further reading / watching:

 • “
USS Abraham Lincoln families press Navy leaders over sailors’ mental health • ,” by Alison Bath
 • “
Yes, We Absolutely Should Talk About Natalie Harp • ,” by Paul Waldman
 • “
Influencers Have a Lot to Say About Politics. Many Are Quietly Paid for It • ,” by Ken Bensinger and Stuart A. Thompson

 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The Pentagon is Waging War on Its Own Paper

Next Friday will be the 25th anniversary of the attacks of 9/11. On the 20th anniversary we broadcast a piece Micah reported called “9/11 broke our brains” — at that time podcast maven Dan Taberski had just released a series called "9/12" about what changed in America the day after the Twin Towers fell.

Included was an interview Taberski did with a documentary filmmaker named Dylan Avery, whose 2005 film Loose Change helped embolden the 9/11 Truther Movement. Micah spoke to Taberski and other guests about why conspiracies theories about the events of 9/11 were (are) so pervasive. 

 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A Look Back at *The* 9/11 Truther Movie

Nowadays, scrappy pirate broadcasters rule over shortwave radio. On this week’s On the Media, an unlikely group of finance bros have plans to take over the frequencies for their own gain. 

In recent years, creative, often music-focused pirate broadcasting has been thriving on shortwave radio. But these surreptitious broadcasters are up against a surprising enemy: Not the FCC, but a deep-pocketed group of finance bros that is trying to wrestle the airwaves away from the public, and use them for a money-making scheme completely antithetical to broadcasting. This week we share an episode of The Divided Dial, which first aired last year. Reporter Katie Thornton asks: What do we lose when we give up our public airwaves? 

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Finance Bros Are Coming for the Public Airwaves

The introduction of AI tools and chatbots in classrooms across the United States has prompted an outcry among concerned parents, teachers, and students. OTM producer and new parent Molly Rosen speaks with Jessica Winter, staff writer at The New Yorker and author of the article “What Will It Take to Get A.I. Out of Schools?,” about how Google Chromebooks have infiltrated schools and what the research says about the impact of AI use on cognitive development.

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

How AI Chatbots are Infiltrating Classrooms

This summer the state of New Mexico sued the Justice department for access to unredacted files related to Jeffrey Epstein. On this week’s On the Media, an Epstein beat reporter shares her ongoing quest for accountability. Plus, an investigation into Tulsi Gabbard’s mysterious relationship with a guru, and how it may have shaped her politics. 

[01:00] Host Brooke Gladstone speaks with Julie K. Brown, an investigative journalist at the Miami Herald, whose reporting in 2018 led to Jeffrey Epstein’s arrest. They discuss how the Epstein files that have been released reveal how prosecutors failed to bring the sex trafficker to justice for years. This conversation first aired earlier this year.

[19:08] Brooke sits down with Jon Swaine, a reporter at the Washington Post, to talk about his masterful long-form reporting on ex-Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard. He investigates Gabbard’s mysterious relationship with her guru, and how it could account for Gabbard’s shapeshifting from Democrat to Bernie Sanders ally to top MAGA staffer.

[36:50] Brooke continues her conversation with Jon Swaine, and they dig into the nuts and bolts of his investigation into Tulsi Gabbard’s relationship with her guru Chris Butler. 

Further reading:

 The Epstein Files by Julie K. Brown
 “Tulsi Gabbard, her guru and the mysterious messages that helped shape her political career,” • by Jon Swaine

On the Media is supported by listeners like you. Support OTM by donating today (https://pledge.wnyc.org/support/otm). Follow our show on Instagram, Bluesky, TikTok and Facebook @onthemedia, and share your thoughts with us by emailing onthemedia@wnyc.org.

 
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A Look Back at The 9/11 Truther Movie

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