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BBC Radio 4


Weekly conversation that will give you an in-depth understanding of the law stories making news and the legal decisions that could have a bearing on everyone in the UK. Whether it's unpicking a landmark legal ruling, explaining how laws are made or seeking clarity for you on a legal issue, The Law Show will be your guide.


Law in Action

The Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood says she makes “no apology” for announcing the roll-out of Live Facial Recognition (LFR) to all the police services in England and Wales. 

Under a government white paper on policing, the number of Live Facial Recognition vans will increase from 10 to 50. 

Police say it’s groundbreaking technology in the fight against crime, but civil liberties groups say it’s authoritarian and a step towards a "surveillance state".

Facial recognition cameras are already used in shops; the difference with LFR is that the software used by police tracks faces against a watchlist - a specific database of faces - from a live video feed. 

But the legal framework regulating the use of the technology is a patchwork of common law, human rights legislation and police guidelines, which has been challenged in the High Court. 

There is also concern about a lack of oversight over how police watchlists are compiled, and why the number of people on the list now stretches into the thousands. 

So is LFR legal? 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles 
Editor: Tom Bigwood

Contributors: 
Sonja Jessup, BBC London’s home affairs correspondent 
Professor Karen Yeung, Interdisciplinary Professorial Fellow in Law, Ethics and Informatics, Birmingham Law School
Dr Asress Gikay, Senior Lecturer in AI, Disruptive Innovation and Law, Brunel, University of London
Richard Ryan a barrister from Blakiston’s, specialising in drone and unmanned aviation law

Is it legal for police to use live facial recognition technology?

The courts system in England and Wales is in an unprecedented crisis. The backlog has reached 80,000 cases, and some defendants are being told they won't be able to have a criminal trial until 2030. 

The government has introduced the Courts and Tribunals Bill, which contains a raft of measures to tackle delays and bring down the backlog; but the Justice Secretary David Lammy has admitted that things are going to get even worse before they get better. 

The most controversial change is a plan to restrict the number of jury trials. The right to judgement by your peers has existed for more than 800 years, but for some offences, that's going to end. 

Defendants will lose the right to choose between a jury trial or a magistrate's hearing in so-called "either-way" offences. 

Magistrates will get increased sentencing powers - up from 12 months to 18 months. 

More serious criminal cases, with likely sentences of up to three years will now be heard by a single judge - and no jury. 

And only the most serious "indictable" offences, like murder, manslaughter and rape and any other offence with a sentence of longer than three years will be heard by a jury.

But will the reforms make a difference? 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles 
Editor: Tom Bigwood

Contributors: 
Sarah Sackman KC, courts and legal services minister
Chris Kinch, KC, who until 2024 was a senior judge at Woolwich Crown Court in south London
David Ford, national chair of the Magistrates Association

The plans to limit jury trials in England and Wales

The former US ambassador Peter Mandelson is on bail after being arrested on suspicion of Misconduct in Public Office. 

Police have been investigating claims that when he was Business secretary, he shared market-sensitive government information with the financier Jeffrey Epstein. 

His arrest comes a few days after police arrested Andrew Mountbatten Windsor, also on suspicion of Misconduct in Public Office, when he was a trade envoy. He is suspected of sharing confidential government documents with Epstein. 

The arrests come after the release of a large number of files by the US Department of Justice. These relate to the activities of Jeffrey Epstein, who was a convicted sex offender. He died in 2019 while awaiting trial on charges of the sex-trafficking of underage girls. 

Andrew Mountbatten Windsor was friends with Epstein. So was Lord Mandelson. 

The BBC has approached Andrew Mountbatten Windsor for a response to these claims. He has always rejected any wrongdoing in connection with Jeffrey Epstein and denied any personal gain from his role as trade envoy. 

Lord Mandelson has not publicly commented in recent weeks on the Epstein files, but the BBC understands his position is he has not acted in any way criminally and that he was not motivated by financial gain.

But what exactly is Misconduct in Public Office? It's a common law offence, with a maximum sentence of life imprisonment, but the Law Commission of England and Wales describes it as "ill-defined ". 

So how did it evolve, who does it apply to, how does it work in practice? 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Editor: Tom Bigwood
Senior Producer: Ravi Naik 
Producer: Charlotte Rowles

Contributors:
Gareth Roberts, Barrister, Exchange chambers 
Kate Bex KC, Red Lion chambers 
Jeremy Horder, Professor of Criminal Law, the London School of Economics
Dr Hayleigh Bosher, a Reader in Intellectual Property Law at Brunel, University of London.

What is Misconduct in Public Office?

Politically motivated attacks on the legal profession in the UK have led to barristers, solicitors, advocates and judges being subjected to violence, death threats and rape threats. Some have faced threats to their family members. 

This is according to the The Bar Council of England and Wales, the Law Society of England and Wales, the Law Society of Scotland, the Faculty of Advocates, the Bar of Northern Ireland and the Law Society of Northern Ireland. These organisations represent a quarter of a million lawyers across the UK, and they have come together to warn about an increasing climate of hostility against legal professionals. 

They say that law firms have been targeted by protesters, and they point out that lawyers are not their clients. So how bad has the situation become, and is it threatening justice or even democracy?

Also on the programme: 
The Scottish Parliament has passed the Land Reform (Scotland) Bill after 3 days of debates and almost 400 amendments lodged - so why is the bill so controversial? 
And using a dodgy "jailbroken-Firestick" to watch illegally-streamed TV may seem like a victimless crime - but is it? 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles 
Editor: Tom Bigwood

Contributors:
Charlie Sherrard KC, criminal barrister with 2BR Chambers
Mark Evans, President of the Law Society
James Cook, BBC Scotland Editor
Éamon Chawke, a solicitor who specialises in intellectual property law at Briffa legal

The law under fire

When the Labour government came to power in 2024, it faced a crisis in the criminal courts, with ever-longer delays and a growing backlog of cases. 

The Ministry of Justice's budget is now one third higher in real terms than in 2019, but according to the latest figures, crown court cases that are yet to be heard reached a record high of 78,329. 

In October, the Justice Secretary David Lammy promised extra funding to increase the number of days that English and Welsh courts will sit next year. 

But is throwing money at the problem enough? How can the courts service be improved, and should jury trials be limited to help clear the backlog?

Also in the programme: 
Protests in support of the banned group Palestine Action could result in trials for as many as 2100 people - so how do courts deal with a sudden influx of cases? 
And are UK laws fair to football fans? 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan
Editor: Tom Bigwood 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles

Contributors: 
Claire Waxman, Victims Commissioner designate,
Riel Karmy-Jones KC, Chair of the Criminal Bar Association of England and Wales,
Dr Steven Cammiss, Associate Professor in Law at the University of Birmingham, 
Professor Geoff Pearson, Professor of Law, University of Manchester.

The court delays crisis

Immigration has dominated headlines for months, but what UK laws cover this most emotive of issues? 

When someone arrives here, what are the legal routes they have to take if they want to stay in the UK? What's the legal difference between an asylum seeker and a refugee? What does "indefinite leave to remain" mean? And what's the difference between being deported, being removed and being extradited? 

How do immigration hearings work? Are our immigration laws fit for purpose, and do they enable us to remove people when required? 

Also on the programme: 
How will the government's digital ID plans help curb illegal immigration?
and wigs in court; as the bar council updates dress advice for its members, we ask two barristers if wigs have had their day. 

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Editor: Tom Bigwood 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles

Contributors
Madeleine Sumption, Director of the Migration Observatory at the University of Oxford 
Paul Gulbenkian, solicitor at OTS solicitors and former immigration Judge 
Morgan Wild, Chief Policy Adviser, Labour Together
Jennifer Devans-Tamakloe, barrister at 23 Essex Street chambers
Benet Brandreth KC, barrister at 11 South Square chambers

Immigration and the law - who stays? Who goes?

The phrase “State related deaths” might mean little to the average person, but it's an umbrella term referring to a death in custody or a mental health setting. It also applies to situations when people have taken their own lives while in the armed forces or even to disasters like Grenfell or Hillsborough. 

What all these have in common is that they are followed by inquests or public inquiries, where investigators or coroners try to work out what caused the deaths. 

Public inquiries are set up to draw conclusions and release their findings, and coroners are required to write a "Prevention of Future Deaths" report when there are lessons to be learned. 

Hundreds of these PFD reports are released in England and Wales each year - yet there is no system in place to ensure preventative changes are made. 

In Scotland, the equivalent is a Fatal Accident Inquiry. It's held by a procurator fiscal - and not a coroner - in front of a sheriff, and has a wider remit than an inquest. It too, can flag up systemic failures that led to a death, and precautions that should be made in future. 

So should the UK have a body that ensures these warnings are heeded?

Also on the programme: 
The government has welcomed Law Commission reforms to Wills - which includes new protections against so-called "predatory marriages". 
And the Supreme Court case which could change the rules for all divorces in England and Wales. 

Presenter: Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles 
Editor: Tara McDermott

Contributors: 
Deborah Coles, Director of the charity Inquest
Kate Stone, barrister at Garden Court North chambers
Alexander Learmonth KC, barrister at New Square chambers
Tracey Moloney, Moloney Family solicitors

How can avoidable deaths be prevented?

The Victims and Courts Bill is progressing through Parliament, and will force convicted criminals to attend their sentencing hearings. 

If criminals convicted of the most serious offences in England or Wales refuse to attend, or are disruptive in court, they will face an extra two years in prison. There are other sanctions too, including missing out on family visits.

‘Reasonable force’ can also be used to get criminals to attend. 

The families of three women killed in London - Sabina Nessa, Jan Mustafa and Zara Aleena - have been campaigning for a new law. In each case, the men who murdered their loved ones refused to come to their sentencing hearings. 

Their families are not alone; the mother of 9 year old Olivia Pratt-Korbel, who was fatally shot in August 2022, has also been calling for a change in the law. The man who murdered her daughter also refused to come to court to be sentenced. 

But will the changes improve the court system for the families of victims? 

Also on the programme:
The first purely-AI legal service has been given the go ahead in England and Wales - what does it mean for the UK legal sector?
And who gets the dog? Why all couples might want to consider a "pet-nup" in case they split up.

Presenter: Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles
Editor Tara McDermott 

Contributors 
Charlie Sherrard KC, criminal justice barrister and judge 
Claire Waxman, Victim's Commissioner for London 
Dr Giulia Gentile, Department of Law, University of Essex and expert on AI and digital regulation 
Samantha Woodham, barrister and co-founder of The Divorce Surgery.

Should killers be forced to attend sentencing hearings?

Wrongful convictions in the Post Office scandal and for train fare evasion have been described by the Government as ‘catastrophic failures’, and it's held a consultation in England and Wales to reform private prosecutions. 

It covers private prosecutions brought by organisations, and also, the SJP - the single justice procedure - where a minor criminal offence is decided by a magistrate behind closed doors. Tens of thousands of rail fines have been quashed, after train companies were found to have misused the SJP system. 

So how should private prosecutions be reformed? 

Also on the programme: 
how "No Further Action" and police cautions can leave a lasting mark on safeguarding and criminal records checks. 

(Note that in Scotland, the nearest equivalent to a police caution is a Procurator Fiscal warning which is usually issued for low level offences such as street drinking or breach of the peace).

Presenter: Dr Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles
Editors: Tara McDermott and Nick Holland 

Contributors: 
Dr Jonathan Rogers, part of the campaign group Criminal Justice Reform Now and Co-Deputy Director of the Cambridge Centre for Criminal Justice
Tristan Kirk court correspondent at the London Evening Standard
Nathalie Potter head of DBS at Olliers solicitors in Manchester

Wrongful convictions: why private prosecutions face reform

What legal responsibilities does a company have to keep your data secure?

M&S, and the Co-op are picking up the pieces after their systems were hacked. 

The cyber criminals claim to have the private information of 20 million people who signed up to Co-op's membership scheme, but the firm have not confirmed that number. The Co-op says the breach did not include members’ passwords, bank or credit card details. However, experts say seemingly innocent information can be used to commit fraud or identity theft.

Companies aren’t the only target; on Monday this week, the Ministry of Justice revealed that the Legal Aid Agency was also hacked in April. 

So can you sue if your private data is stolen in this way? And if you're the employee who clicked on a hacker's dodgy link in an email, how liable are you for any losses that occur?

Also on the programme: 
How survivors of domestic violence in Scotland want to be told if their attackers make plea deals. 

Presenter: Joelle Grogan 
Producers: Ravi Naik and Charlotte Rowles 
Editor: Tara McDermott

Contributors 
Joe Tidy, BBC Cyber Correspondent 
Tim Capel, Legal Counsel for the Information Commissioner’s Office
Ian Jeffrey, Chief Executive of the Law Society
Brian McConnachie KC, a former crown prosecutor and now a senior advocate:

Is it legal for police to use live facial recognition technology?

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