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The New York Times

“Hard Fork” is a show about the future that’s already here. Each week, journalists Kevin Roose and Casey Newton explore and make sense of the latest in the rapidly changing world of tech. 

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. 

Listen to this podcast in New York Times Audio, our new iOS app for news subscribers. Download now at nytimes.com/audioapp

Hard Fork

Last Friday, a panel of federal judges denied TikTok’s petition to overturn the law that could force the ban of the app in the United States. We walk through the judges reasoning and explain why TikTok’s First Amendment argument was unsuccessful. Then, Julian Kelly, the director of quantum hardware at Google Quantum AI, explains how close we are to quantum computers that can solve practical problems. Finally, we talk about a new sentiment sweeping Silicon Valley: affection for the chatbot Claude.

 

Guest:

Julian Kelly • , director of quantum hardware at Google Quantum AI.

 

Additional Reading: 

TikTok Faces U.S. Ban After Losing Bid to Overturn New LawQuantum Computing Inches Closer to Reality After Another Google BreakthroughCult of ClaudeDealBook Summit Podcast: The A.I. Revolution • 

 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

TikTok's Last Stand + Google's Quantum Breakthrough + Cult of Claude

This week, we took a field trip to the Phoenix suburbs to see Amazon’s newest iteration of drone delivery service in action. We toured the facility where these drones are in operation, spoke with the vice president and general manager of Prime Air, David Carbon, and watched from a local backyard as our own order dropped from the sky.

Guest:

 • David Carbon, vice president and general manager of Amazon Prime Air.

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Is Amazon's Drone Delivery Finally Ready for Prime Time?

Happy Holidays, everybody! We are off this week, but we wanted to bring you a recent episode from another New York Times podcast: The Wirecutter Show. It’s called “Kitchen Gear That Lasts a Lifetime (or Extremely Close)” and features Michael Sullivan, one of the senior staff writers on Wirecutter’s kitchen team. Michael walks through tips and tricks for finding kitchen gear that will last, what’s worth spending money on, what you can buy used and how to make cast iron last a lifetime.

 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

The Wirecutter Show: Kitchen Gear That Lasts a Lifetime (or Extremely Close)

This week, it’s our yearly tech predictions. We’ll review what we got right and wrong about 2024, and tell you what we think is going to happen in 2025. Then we’ll discuss how we want to interact with tech in the new year. Plus, we’ll answer some of your listener questions.

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Our 2025 Tech Predictions and Resolutions + We Answer Your Questions

This week, Meta announced a series of content moderation changes that will transform the way the social media company’s platforms deal with misinformation and hate speech. We break down what these changes will mean for users and why the company seems to be caving to the right’s arguments on censorship. Then, we’ll explain why 2025 is already shaping up to be a huge year in A.I. — with models like OpenAI’s o3, Google’s Gemini 2.0 and DeepSeek, from China, stirring discussion that superintelligence is near. And finally, we play a round of HatGPT.

 

Additional Reading:

Meta Says It Will End Its Fact-Checking Program on Social Media PostsOpenAI Unveils New A.I. That Can ‘Reason’ Through Math and Science ProblemsNetflix’s WWE investment and the Future of Live Events on the PlatformMegaLag’s Video Investigation Into HoneyLos Angeles Man Is Trapped in Circling Waymo on Way to Airport: ‘Is Somebody Playing a Joke?’
 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Meta Goes MAGA Mode +A Big Month in A.I. + HatGPT

The deadline for TikTok to sell or to face a ban is fast approaching. We discuss how Supreme Court justices — who opted on Friday to uphold the law — reacted to arguments in the case, whether the Chinese government might allow Elon Musk to buy the app, and why self-proclaimed TikTok refugees are rushing to a different Chinese app, called RedNote. Then, we talk with an A.I. industry insider about what we actually know about how bad artificial intelligence is for the environment. And finally, after Mark Zuckerberg’s recent appearance on Joe Rogan’s podcast, Casey offers Kevin some ideas for how to bring more “masculine energy” to Meta.

 

Guest: 

Sasha Luccioni • , A.I and climate lead at Hugging Face.

 

Additional Reading: 

Supreme Court Backs Law Requiring TikTok to Be Sold or Banned‘Red Note,’ a Chinese App, Is Dominating Downloads, Thanks to TikTok UsersChina Weighs Sale of TikTok US to Musk as a Possible OptionMatter of Opinion Podcast: How Democrats Drove Silicon Valley Into Trump’s Arms
 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Goodbye TikTok, Ni Hao RedNote? + A.I.'s Environmental Impact + Meta's Masculine Energy

This week, TikTok died, came back to life — and now exists in a kind of limbo state. We break down what that may signal for how tech does business with the new Trump administration. Then we pump up the fun with memecoins and explore how the Trump family is cashing in. And finally, MSNBC’s Chris Hayes joins us to discuss his new book about attention.

 

Guest:

Chris Hayes • , Host of MSNBC's "All In With Chris Hayes" and author of “The Sirens’ Call”

 

Additional Reading:

TikTok Comes Back From the DeadTrump’s Cryptocurrency Surges to Become One of the World’s Most ValuableChris Hayes: I Want Your Attention. I Need Your Attention. Here Is How I Mastered My Own.The 100 Best Books of the 21st Century
 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Quantum TikTok + Memecoin Mania + Chris Hayes on the Attention Wars

A Chinese firm called DeepSeek managed to upend global markets at the start of the week, to drag down chipmaker Nvidia — and to surge to No. 1 in the iPhone app store, all in basically no time at all.

Today, in this bonus episode, we talk through the news behind the freakout. How is a new A.I. model from one Chinese A.I. company making such a big splash? And what does it mean for the U.S. artificial intelligence industry?

 

We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube and TikTok.

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Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

Your Guide to the DeepSeek Freakout: an Emergency Pod

This week we go even deeper on DeepSeek. ChinaTalk's Jordan Schneider joins us to explain the Chinese A.I. industry and to break down the reaction inside of China to DeepSeek’s sudden success. Then … hello, Operator! We put OpenAI’s new agent software to the test. And finally, all aboard for another ride on the Hot Mess Express!

 

Guest:

Jordan Schneider • , founder and editor in chief of ChinaTalk

 

Additional Reading:

Why DeepSeek Could Change What Silicon Valley Believes About A.I.OpenAI launches its agentFable, a Book App, Makes Changes After Offensive A.I. MessagesAmazon Pauses Drone Deliveries After Aircraft Crashed in Rain
 

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

DeepSeek DeepDive + Hands-On With Operator + Hot Mess Express!

This week, we’re joined by the Times reporter Jonathan Swan to discuss Elon Musk’s tech takeover of Washington, D.C. Then, Liz Pelly, author of a new book about Spotify, stops by to discuss “ghost musicians” and how Spotify’s algorithms are reshaping music culture. And finally — it’s Tool Time! We’ll tell you all about the new A.I. tools we’re using, plus the one that we wish existed.

Guests: 

Jonathan Swan • , a White House reporter for The New York Times
Liz Pelly • , author of “Mood Machine: The Rise of Spotify and the Costs of the Perfect Playlist”

Additional Reading: 

Inside Musk’s Aggressive Incursion Into the Federal GovernmentThe Ghosts in the MachineChatGPT's deep research might be the first good agent

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

The Musketeers Take Washington + Spotify's Ghost Music + Tool Time

Hosts Kevin Roose and Casey Newton explore stories from the wild frontier of tech.

What’s real? What’s hype? “Hard Fork” is here to help you make sense of it. Tune in every Friday.

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

What’s a Hard Fork?

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